interesting read...

Small part of a long thread on WS, but always good to see others opinions.



First unread post • 223 posts • Page 5 of 5 • 12345
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 05:15
Dont think any company acts in a random manner (except perhaps DES who by the way have 2C of 85 mm bbls to their name) but all this conspiracy theory stuff such as PL holding newsflow back cos markets are shite is nonsense.
What happened to granite being pierced in Georgia? Actually turns out they never even got through it. Then there was carp about oil being found but not letting anyone know till the 'ii's loaded up'.
Next Puntland need the ii's to get in so release poorly worded RNS. This 'nothing is random' comment means f all.
The operation results will do the talking and right now they aint exactly shouting too much good news, hence 6.3p.

MegaOil wrote:
> Seems the noise level behind the Doom is cranking up
>
> Just remember Range is far from Random
>
> Money can be made in all directions, with or without any announcements
alphamale

Posts: 254
Joined: Mar 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 06:30
"this nothing is random comment means f all"

I'll answer that one for you the current share price is NOT random it is being driven down helped by general market sentiment and bad news whilst shares are being accumulated.

Apologies now I'm nowhere near as good as TF with these but if you work through the screen casts you should see...................BTW this has been going on for quite a number of days so whilst overall daily volumes are not massive the aggregate effect is a substantial accumulation of stock. Someone out there very much seems to think the gloom is a prelude to Boom time!

http://screencast.com/t/k0F4KOpt77
http://screencast.com/t/jNB8TjOmlA5 http://screencast.com/t/t5FAnaeLdq6O http://screencast.com/t/JOLywZb5vus http://screencast.com/t/DN0djsZuBqO
kev yorks

Posts: 276
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Yorkshire
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 07:08
Kevin those ss are interesting. But who is doing it? why? and for how much longer?
TF posted similar shots as you say several months ago.

Momo

Posts: 66
Joined: Mar 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 07:11
Thanks for all the information Kev my first post here - I'm trying to understand whats going on with this order book manipulation.

It seem that that the same person loaded the bid and the ask to create a range in which to trade is this correct? (3 bids 3 asks similar values etc)

http://screencast.com/t/jNB8TjOmlA5

Can you please explain what is happening in the screen shot where the 500k order is taken out by AT trade?

http://screencast.com/t/JOLywZb5vus

This also seems to have happened here ...

http://screencast.com/t/t5FAnaeLdq6O

Are these two different DMA traders trying to control the direction of the stock or something else?

Been in range for a while now first real punt on AIM and reading all the fundamentals I was sure I had invested in one of the soundest shares, of course I'm still learning..!

kev yorks wrote:
> "this nothing is random comment means f all"
>
> I'll answer that one for you the current share price is NOT random it is
> being driven down helped by general market sentiment and bad news whilst
> shares are being accumulated.
>
ebngy

Posts: 1
Joined: Mar 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 07:33
Who take a guess............but someone confident of offloading a lot of stock at a higher price and to offload that amount of stock easily will require big news to up the demand.

Why....................profit its the only reason we are here

How much longer............wish I knew but its got more obvious as the weeks gone on so I'd guess time is short for further accumulation

ebngy there are better qualified than me to go into it in detail but essentially there where 2 sells 500k and 50k at the full bid price as these go through they nullify take these bids off the book.........however if the buyer wants lots of stock computer programs can be set up to instantly replace the bid and so keep accumulating the stock........................these guys are being clever though they could just go out and keep offering full ask price and buying the stock that is on the sell side but this would have the effect of pushing up the price as the sell side was taken out.
They could also set a broker on to accumulate stock for them this would be seen on the book every now and again as large delayed buys.
The reason why I say these guys are clever is they are just positioning themselves at the top of the bid and waiting for the sellers to come to them, thereby not driving the price up and accumulating on the quiet. Using the shit markets, bad sentiment and the general doom and gloom to have the sellers come to them as they are worn down waiting for news.

Kev
kev yorks

Posts: 276
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Yorkshire
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 08:07
We have had this accumulation theory for ages. I am not saying it isn't happening but why am I always able to buy but selling is not always possible?
Jimmyoneshot

Posts: 12
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Derbyshire
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 08:51
Kev you still think new highs could be achieved this year or our we looking at 2013 now for that to be possible? Thanks.

mmm281664

Posts: 106
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: yorkshire
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 10:04
if new spin off will ritch the newbie have to top every week in 2 new shares now?
and will it effect the linear DAX correlation?
: )))))))))))))))))
HOA

Posts: 111
Joined: Apr 2012
Location: Atlantis
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 11:02
kev yorks wrote:
> Who take a guess............but someone confident of offloading a lot of
> stock at a higher price and to offload that amount of stock easily will
> require big news to up the demand.
>
> Why....................profit its the only reason we are here


That is the most important part Kev

And enough clues have been given by BOD to assume you are correct
MegaOil

Posts: 28
Joined: Mar 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 11:09
the problem is knowing when the offloader is selling so you can sell before him lol

MegaOil wrote:
> kev yorks wrote:
> > Who take a guess............but someone confident of offloading a lot of
> > stock at a higher price and to offload that amount of stock easily will
> > require big news to up the demand.
> >
> > Why....................profit its the only reason we are here
>
>
> That is the most important part Kev
>
> And enough clues have been given by BOD to assume you are correct

Happy Trader

Posts: 202
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: England
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 17:44
That accumulation might be happening for a RRL buy back ?

I noticed the 500k orders all week, someone is accumulating very cleverly here off the back of weak sentiment and markets.
MWW

Posts: 18
Joined: Apr 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 18:40
Quite a few picked up on PL's email, "make sure you stay on for the ride back up..." or words to that effect.

He is expecting it to go back up, and must have some idea of news timeline in the weeks ahead.
SASP (the Legend)

Posts: 128
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: United Kingdom
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 18:46
> That is the most important part Kev
>
> And enough clues have been given by BOD to assume you are correct

They will sell-off whilst the sentiment is in overdrive. Bit like the exagerrated doom time?

What sort of figures for accumulation are we talking about? And could there be news to swallow-up any sell-off?
SASP (the Legend)

Posts: 128
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: United Kingdom
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 19:20
KY

I hope you are correct that someone is accumulating.
As Jimmyoneshot says, however, ther has been speculation about this for a long time.

Could these buys not be a shorter regularly reloading/buying back in an efficient way ?
I think it was TF that said he believed we had been getting shorted since 15p and FWIW
I am of the same opinion.
berndor

Posts: 4
Joined: Mar 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 20:11
Nice analysis Kev. Like MWW and others I have been tracking these 500Ks over the past few days, as I have variously posted on the LSE board. They seemed very keen to ensure they picked up shares, as often moved up the bid over the course of the day to ensure their order was filled. On at least one occasion it seemed to be an iceberg. Accumulation was my positive-side theory too, though I also wondered whether there may be some relationship with, for example, the 100K seller we have seen. Buy off the bid by AT, having sold into it higher on O trades earlier... i.e. a trader.
ErraticPhil

Posts: 40
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Guildford, UK
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 20:57
Mega, have you been making money whilst in the downward direction?


MegaOil wrote:
> Seems the noise level behind the Doom is cranking up
>
> Just remember Range is far from Random
>
> Money can be made in all directions, with or without any announcements
miniboy

Posts: 45
Joined: Mar 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 21:13
I've been watching the same prior to this week just in smaller tranches, the anti has been stepped up this week moving the block upto 500k no doubt taking advantage of the bad sentiment generally and Range. My thinking is PL has made it clear to all and sundry that there will be a buyback and in all probability house brokers are loading up cheap now to sell into this process............they do after all have the inside line on time frames etc.

Kev
kev yorks

Posts: 276
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Yorkshire
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 22:19
>My thinking is PL has made it clear to all and sundry that there will be a buyback and in all probability house brokers are loading up cheap now to sell into this process............they do after all have the inside line on time frames etc.

Exactly the reason why the ordinary joes never make any money with Range for being devotees, for our sins. There's so many shares to load up on, it gets battered by abuse from this constant (oft block) buying up and then dumping of stock in a short timeframe.

In a sense I dread the first sniff of success as you know full well brokers and traders will just dump huge chunks and any physical, material progress made won't be reflected in the SP because of these constant, tiresome greedy games. It's just sad. I don't know what can be done about it but Range is so open to this kind of thing on a daily basis.
OhTheHorror!

Posts: 81
Joined: Apr 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 22:25
Hence they make it in all directions

They hit the market on the short side, wipeout the derivate longs in the process, make it going down.

Have the derampers sell the negative news on story and Directors, adds negative influence to PI

Keep throwing stock at the various stops, yet continue to accumulate long term stock, knowing the forward game, because they are professionals and have patience at the detriment to the nervous and less fortunate

Who are those that Should Be Most under criticism and pressure?

Those who convinced their esteemed High Worth Private Clients to invest in the story at much higher than current price levels

It's a well thought out professional play and apparently executed to date it would appear
MegaOil

Posts: 28
Joined: Mar 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 22:35
Mega, do you think there is an 'end game' or that we will now always be a bent share traded up and down by the 'insiders' which must include the BOD

MegaOil wrote:
> Hence they make it in all directions
>
> They hit the market on the short side, wipeout the derivate longs in the
> process, make it going down.
>
> Have the derampers sell the negative news on story and Directors, adds
> negative influence to PI
>
> Keep throwing stock at the various stops, yet continue to accumulate long
> term stock, knowing the forward game, because they are professionals and
> have patience at the detriment to the nervous and less fortunate
>
> Who are those that Should Be Most under criticism and pressure?
>
> Those who convinced their esteemed High Worth Private Clients to invest in
> the story at much higher than current price levels
>
> It's a well thought out professional play and apparently executed to date
> it would appear
miniboy

Posts: 45
Joined: Mar 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 22:46
miniboy wrote:
> Mega, do you think there is an 'end game' or that we will now always be a bent share
> traded up and down by the 'insiders' which must include the BOD

This story always was an End Game and there is a clear path to it

I don't totally agree with the BOD aspect though, reality is BOD need avenues to both friendly parties and development capital

Just remember friendly Brokers right now apparently in TT and C with Directors so it's known they are getting a picture of Range future and business plan
MegaOil

Posts: 28
Joined: Mar 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 23:04
Thanks Mega, your observations always appreciated

MegaOil wrote:
> miniboy wrote:
> > Mega, do you think there is an 'end game' or that we will now always be a bent
> share
> > traded up and down by the 'insiders' which must include the BOD
>
> This story always was an End Game and there is a clear path to it
>
> I don't totally agree with the BOD aspect though, reality is BOD need avenues to both
> friendly parties and development capital
>
> Just remember friendly Brokers right now apparently in TT and C with Directors so
> it's known they are getting a picture of Range future and business plan
miniboy

Posts: 45
Joined: Mar 2012
Re: Doom and Boom
02 Jun 2012, 23:12
MegaOil wrote:
> Hence they make it in all directions
>
> They hit the market on the short side, wipeout the derivate longs in the
> process, make it going down.
>
> Have the derampers sell the negative news on story and Directors, adds
> negative influence to PI


Mega

Re just the point on derampers just reading the email responses from PL to pis' over the past few months made me feel, now on reflection, that he was part of this 'deramp' process by continuously releasing info that did not materialise. Time after time he released the same info, eg: on Stockmailer. I got the feeling he wanted to piss off pis'. For what reason I am not sure. I mused with wanting the sp lower or wanting us out. And those share purchases volumes.... forgive me, but didn't impress me at all.

I want to believe in these guys but one major area PL needs to clean up, if he is to be seen as a genuine CEO keen on pis' is to communicate.... ( christ I was going to say effectively but I suppose until we see the end game we won't know if his comms game has been the method to achieve that ) so I will say with integrity. If I were him I would forsake answering all pis' emails with a regular conf call quarterly and maybe a monthly q and a release on their website end of between RNS. Cut the clouds of uncertainty and confusion out with the babble in between.

Sorry if this sounds pathetic but with JR babble followed by increased PL's almost frenetic verbal diarrhea has got to me (mmm as can be seen by my own above) D

Donkey