the lying wabbott not pm material, page-89

re: denman.. howard shows contempt for australians Denman

I don't think that pulling out all the clever but (imho) disconnected points or threads that made up her speech legitimizes the basis of her and Beazley's censure motion.

The two of them streched out a one or two paragraph argument into two over-the-top lectures. It was patently overstating the depth of Abbott's "crime"

You quote Gillard as saying..... "Mr Howard can't apply one standard to Mr Brogden and a completely different and lesser standard to Tony Abbott."

Well that's just rhetoric - it came from her assumption that Howard wanted Brogden to resign. Having made that assumption she further jumps to the conclusion that the Brogden and Abbot comments were somehow equally bad. I don't see Abbott's as anywhere near Brogden's.

You shouldn't justify the level of indignation (imho contrived) by the quality of the debating style - you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

I mentioned her breathless moments in response to your comment about her lowering her voice - good drama but doesn't add to the quality of her argument - only the style.

Finally, I'm happy to debate you, but if you want to get personal, find someone else.

regards