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Have you ever made a profit cujo . ? You are well underwater on bru and kar ! Sometimes more money is made by preserving cash and staying out of the market - have you ever heard of a vehicle called index options ? You can actually trade the direction of a whole index - xjo , sp500 Dow jones - -and if your a registered trader with ato you can actually bUy and sell the index multiple times per day !!! Problem is it's as boring as a mark Latham or bill shorten policy speech so to fill in the day between index trades there are the cult stock threads to engage in light hearted banter cdu and plv were 2 of the best but bru and kar hold some entertainment value as they once were promising stocks that looked like they may go somewhere !! Alas it looks like that somewhere has been down the Brasco for the last few years