The day and hour

Originally posted by MrGordon ↑

Good grief, even MrG understands that the "this" does not refer to the fig tree.
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Thanks Copper, it's not often I'm given credit. What has been missed in the debate is that Jesus was referring to a "sign" of his "presence" that was to occur in "the conclusion of the system of things". This is only mentioned by Matthew.

(Matthew 24:3) While he was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples approached him privately, saying: “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your presence and of the conclusion of the system of things?”

(Mark 13:4) “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign when all these things are to come to a conclusion?”

(Luke 21:7) Then they questioned him, saying: “Teacher, when will these things actually be, and what will be the sign when these things are to occur?”

If you read the context of these 3 accounts you will see the disciples inquired about the destruction of the temple.History tells us this occurred in the year 70 CE , some 37 years after the question was asked.
The startling aspects of the "sign" of his "presence"Jesus gave will strike fear into the hearts of scoffers.
(Luke 21:25-28) “Also, there will be signs in the sun and moon and stars, and on the earth anguish of nations not knowing the way out because of the roaring of the sea and its agitation. 26 People will become faint out of fear and expectation of the things coming upon the inhabited earth, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 27 And then they will see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 But as these things start to occur, stand up straight and lift up your heads, because your deliverance is getting near.”

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"Thanks Copper, it's not often I'm given credit. What has been missed in the debate is that Jesus was referring to a "sign" of his "presence" that was to occur in "the conclusion of the system of things". This is only mentioned by Matthew."

I don't see what material difference it makes if the word "presence" is used. Especially when only used 1 out of 3.

As far as I can see, in this particular discourse, the signs were grouped together. Clearly part of the one narrative.
Jesus was warning these particular disciples what was to happen in their lifetime. Not some to occur within their generation (relating to the destruction of the temple and massacre of the Jews) and some not until thousands of years later.
It just doesn't ring true and the future is invoked because some of those predicted events didn't happen at that time.

I don't understand why it is necessary to claim the Bible is the inerrant word of God and all other beliefs are the work of some mythical bogey man, in order to follow the sensible indications for living that Jesus brought.