Grahod No arrogance on my part because I haven't seen any movement on your part to it being anything but a plane and jet fuel reason for the collapse (that I have read anyway, and if I'm wrong I apologise). But I notice that you have now moved from science to logistics ... now come Garhod, you can't accuse me of stepping outside my are of speciality, and then put forward a logistics hypothesis, surely that would be outside your are of specialisation. I'm sorry if you have an emotional attachment to this, I am just looking for a few facts, rather than assumptions and hypotheses to prove a predetermined conclusion ... and so are many in your own profession ... surely reason enough to keep an open mind. cheers marz