Appreciate the time you’ve taken to write all that out — I can see you’re passionate about what you believe, and that’s something I respect.
Just to clarify though, I think there’s a misunderstanding here — I’m not trying to defend any institution like the RCC, RCman, Ppm56, Augustine, or anyone else. I honestly couldn’t care less whether they agree with me or not. My only concern is what is written in Scripture. That’s where the truth is, and that’s what I aim to stand on.
Now, I get where you're coming from — Yeshua's life certainly reflected the ultimate example of surrender, peace, and love. But we also can’t ignore the distinction between His mission (to lay down His life willingly) and the rest of us living in a broken world where evil is real, and protecting the innocent is not only necessary, but godly.
You mentioned Luke 9:54 and John 18:10, and I agree — Yeshua rebuked His disciples in those moments because they misunderstood the purpose of that specific time. It wasn't that self-defence is always wrong — it was that Yeshua was fulfilling prophecy and walking toward the cross on purpose.
But this is where it seems you're missing my actual point.
I’m not talking about going around seeking vengeance or fighting for pride’s sake. I’m talking about stepping in to stop evil, like defending someone from being raped, bashed, or murdered in real time. That’s not vengeance — that’s love in action. I’d rather give up my own life if needed, but I’d also act if I was in the position to stop it. As I said, God will judge my heart in that moment, and I believe Scripture backs this mindset up.
Let’s keep the focus here on the Word: Exodus 22:2 (TLV) — “If the thief is caught breaking in and is struck so that he dies, there is no bloodguilt.”
This isn’t about paganism or Rome — this is the Word of God, and it draws a clear line between murder and self-defence.
Even after Yeshua's ascension, we see the same logic:
Romans 13:4 shows that God allows justice and force through authority.
Acts 23 shows Paul using wisdom and protection when under threat.
1 Timothy 5:8 speaks of protecting your household.
Yeshua Himself said, “buy a sword” (Luke 22:36), knowing full well the dangers His disciples would face.
None of these examples conflict with a loving God. In fact, they reflect a God who values life, protection, justice, and mercy at the same time.
You say that death is not of God — but that’s not the full picture. God Himself brought judgment by death multiple times throughout Scripture, and Revelation shows that He will do so again. That doesn’t make Him evil. It makes Him just, righteous, and loving — toward the innocent who suffer at the hands of evil.
You’re right that God doesn’t change — and I completely agree with the verses you quoted (Malachi 3:6, Hebrews 13:8, etc). But that actually supports my point — the same God who judged wickedness in the Old Testament still holds the same standards today. His character hasn’t shifted. His grace through Yeshua is greater — but His justice never disappeared.
So let’s not accuse the God of the Bible of being “pagan” just because He executes judgment. The real danger is trying to fit God into our own human definitions of love, while ignoring how Scripture defines it — which includes truth, justice, and mercy.
Lastly, I’m not “attacking” your position — I’m just holding to mine because I genuinely believe it aligns better with the full counsel of Scripture. I’m always willing to listen, but not at the cost of stepping away from what the Word says just to make God seem more palatable.
Let’s keep sharpening one another in love — I appreciate the convo
