these guys are a joke, page-6

Oh, yes, I follow now. It's the sp that's needed to get a former note holder back to what he would have been redeemed for. Thanks.

I suppose there's no need for management to take any risks. Leave that to the shareholders.

Capitalisation doesn't look unreasonable now. I did well on the notes but lost on the shares.

I guess I'm nervous about giving what I did make back again.

On the other hand, a lot of money has been made spotting value in seemingly hopeless causes.

My first big lesson was something called the Emu Bay Railway. One investor saw this and was virtually the only buyer for several years. All my friends laughed at him until one day it came good and he made a fortune.