Ann: Becoming a substantial holder , page-15

goodaye Buddy, Tui,
t/u from me.

i also ahd a quick look at the Sub s/h notice.
i wanted to try and work out what the current Top20 would look like.
but i think its pretty nigh on impossible for us to determine that, simply because we do not have all the info.

as Buddy correctly mentioned, there is a lot of "silly buggers" going on with BOW trading.
its also happening to ESG.

what we do know, is these funds are arbitraging, trading etc, shorting maybe and using algorithmic trading, which all distorts the market trading perspective.

what we need to look out for in trying to determine "who's up who and why", is that with these Sub s/h notices it is very easy to double-count.

if anyone has any "interest" in anyone else's shares, then they usually are classified as "associated" to them.

so many of these sub s/h notices relate to the borrowing of stock.
so Mathew capital lends its stock to say Deutsche Bank.
DB has a Borrowing Agreement with mathews, and might also have voting rights associated with those shares.
So then DB has to lodge a Sub s/h notice.
But its the same block of shares.
So its easy to double- count imho.

in that latest Morgan STanley sub s/h notice, it seems all the MS family have their fingers in the pie.
But it looks like Dekabank Deutsche (got no idea who they are) are the "beneficial" owners of the stock, and have lent that stock to MS.
so that makes MS associated with Deka.
so then MS has to add its shares relating to the Deka deal, with any shares it has in BOW in its other entities.
so it just gets bigger and more complex.

I think Bank of America has a similar deal with Merill Lynch. are they same group?

so i find it really confusing trying to work out where veryone stands.

probably the only way to find out conclusively, is to look at the share register. mind, it won't tell them who is behind nominee coys, but BOW could do a search process if they really needed to know, but we would not be privy to that info.
you can bet that BOW and Arrow will be doing just that every day.

cheers