you believe that a debate about philosophy can not involve religion have you seen chickens with lips?
there is two words to note here religion and faith nearly every poster on this particular forum has displayed a gross misunderstanding of them, and therefore, whenever these topics come up, the foundational ignorance on which these erroneous views are based upon (and arise as a consequence), creates the same old tyred cycles of going around in circles and wasting precious time. imagine if at the end of your life you realise that much of your arguments/views were the result of willfully not seeing clearly, then imagine if you don't see this at all. no one in there "right mind" would contribute to this incessant perpetuation of insanity.
