I'm getting tired of this discussion because what I am saying is not being understood. You make some valid points about why you don't like the senate, I'm not arguing against those.
But I strongly suggest that you and oconnem perhaps wander outside your houses at some stage and try to find out what 'real' Australians look like, sound like, and act like. Not just inside whatever social circle you have, I mean everyone.
After that, I want to you honestly compare the way those people think to both houses of Parliament, and then honestly tell me which one looks like 'real australia' the most. The senate preference system may be strange and arcane, but through this mechanism it has generated, in my opinion, one of the most wacky assortments of personalities we've ever had. Coincidentally, that's closer to what real Australia looks like than the other house has to offer, rightly or wrongly.
You can make the argument that 'ordinary aussies' have no place making laws in the senate, and perhaps you would be right on that. That's your opinion and you're entitled to have it.
It's ironic though, that all the complaints about the senate system recently reached a crescendo when Tony was elected against a somewhat hostile senate, and looky here, they came from his supporters.
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