Sorry eddieby, your prto Kremlin narrative that it was the West...

  1. 4,953 Posts.

    Sorry eddieby, your prto Kremlin narrative that it was the West who prevented Ukraine from surrendering in 2022 is simply that, an easily debunked pro Kremlin narrative.

    Cherry picking isolated events and points in time when the topic you are deliberately misrepresenting lasted several months and was influenced by many major factors over that time is a clear sign that you are deliberately trying to establish a false narrative.

    I will continue to call out your lies as others on here have noted.



    Initial Negotiations
    • Date: February 28, 2022

    • Key Point: The first negotiations took place in Belarus, with Russia demanding Ukraine's neutrality, demilitarization, and recognition of Crimea as part of Russia. Ukraine, in contrast, insisted on maintaining its sovereignty and demanded a complete Russian military withdrawal. This initial meeting revealed irreconcilable differences.
    • Why Critical: The early gap between the parties’ objectives set the stage for a stalemate, as Ukraine would not accept any loss of territory, and Russia pushed for long-term control.



    Russian War Crimes and Mariupol Siege
    • Date: March-April 2022

    • Key Point: The siege of Mariupol and revelations of atrocities in places like Bucha fundamentally changed the tone of the negotiations. Reports of civilian killings, particularly the Bucha massacre, made it impossible for Ukraine to continue negotiating in good faith, as they saw Russia as committing war crimes.
    • Why Critical: The brutal nature of Russia’s invasion, with war crimes being committed, hardened Ukraine's resolve and diminished any potential for compromise.



    Unacceptable Russian Territorial Demands
    • Date: February-March 2022

    • Key Point: Russia insisted on Ukraine recognizing Crimea as part of Russia and the independence of the so-called Donetsk and Luhansk People’s Republics. These demands were non-negotiable for Ukraine, which viewed them as blatant violations of its territorial integrity.
    • Why Critical: Russia’s territorial ambitions were central to its invasion, and Ukraine could not agree to cede any of its sovereign territory without undermining its national security and independence.



    Putin’s Changing Demands
    • Date: March-April 2022

    • Key Point: Initially, Russia sought a negotiated settlement that would ensure Ukrainian neutrality. However, as the war dragged on, Putin’s demands escalated to include the full "denazification" and "demilitarization" of Ukraine, which were effectively calls for regime change in Kyiv. This made any negotiations practically impossible for Ukraine.
    • Why Critical: Putin’s shifting goals showed Russia’s unwillingness to settle for anything less than control over Ukraine’s political future, further alienating Ukraine from the negotiation table.



    Zelenskyy’s Shift in Stance After War Crimes
    • Date: April 2022

    • Key Point: In response to the atrocities committed in places like Bucha, Ukrainian President Zelenskyy declared that Ukraine would not negotiate with Russia as long as Putin remained in power. The political cost of continuing negotiations with an aggressor responsible for mass civilian killings became untenable for Ukraine.
    • Why Critical: This marked a definitive break in the talks, as Zelenskyy effectively stated that meaningful negotiations would only be possible with a change in Russia’s leadership.

 
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