@Stickshift (yes reply is broken) I think it leaves too much room for people with power and either a great deal of ignorance/ego or serious psychopathy to engage in thuggery which they are typically very good at because they can conveniently be blissfully unaware of the trauma they inflict on the people who have worked and saved over many years to be able to support those companies and benefit (maybe) from their success. From what I've seen the pumps and dumps seem to occur when instos/capitalists get their hands on large numbers of shares for ridiculous discounts to share prices eg, 25% to monthly VWAP. Of course they pass it off as being a great source of capital for startups - it is typically the more patient/stable shareholders who pay for it with the time they are willing to hold their small part. Yes this costs those holders money and time holding. Not only do the instos get their 25% but also feel they need to pump the share price as well because it just isn't enough.
My impression is 'shorters' just pump, dump and short anyway simultaneously with their mates and just effectively hedge everything. They think risk shouldn't apply to them. Oh sorry they're here as a mechanism to help stop us from losing money... that's very responsible of them. (apologies for the sarcasm)
So no stock should be valued ahead of time? If people do a little research and don't over-extend themselves financially which will always happen to some extent , shorting or not, there wouldn't be a problem eg, why I didn't sell all my BRN shares and empty my bank account to invest in Afterpay (just an example as I have done zero research on it -though not keen on a company that encourages credit). I stuck with BRN that I feel I understand and made sure I had enough money saved as a backup should things not go as I hope they will (which is a marked improvement on my rash decisions in the past and have been privileged enough to remain employed during that period). What I hope is the share price stays pretty much stagnant until they get commercial traction though I know as things stand that the SP will fluctuate. At some point doesn't cashing in on the way up help to moderate increases in price? Isn't that where common sense on how much you put into something kicks in? (possibly not for someone who's wages has been suppressed for years, is stuck in a rent cycle and sees no way ahead) How about having a limit on how many trades you can make a day, 2 for each share ?(sound reasonable doesn't it?) Oh I can see high-volume trader's/shorters'/ASX faces going red as I speak this can't possibly apply to them they rely on liquidity to create volatility and use exemptions to rules to step all over everyone else. The ASX (as a non-privatised public institution) being mandated to require more stringent minimum standards for listing companies would also be a significant improvement. Constant volatility is not necessary for investors. If you're concerned about liquidity maybe the company should be required to hold a significant percentage of it's shares as a float at the monthly VWAP so as to allow people to get in and out if needed. Surely there are enough stock market manipulation geniuses out there to work out a system for that.
On a slight tangent I saw a video where a diagnosed psychopath was being interviewed (ask a psychopath) and the only reason they sought to understand how their interactions negatively affected others was because they noticed that their life fell apart every 3 years or so and it was inconveniencing them. New job, new friends, new life. Not, from what I could make out, for any reason outside that. Not as though they were inherently evil or anything they just couldn't process emotions like a majority of people but certainly a worrying fact. It feels to me like the financial sector is swimming with them, not to mention people who have experienced ridiculous levels of financial privilege their entire life and just don't get the concepts of responsibility, equity and empathy and on the other end maybe a few who are truly desperate and will do anything for a buck. No doubt they aren't all bad but it's certainly seems to attract some special people.
Am I just being totally naive or was the stockmarket created to support businesses that could add actual value to communities and allow the wider public to potentially share in their success? What a massive abstracted joke of a game it has become. Maybe there is a middle ground there somewhere.
PF: *wearing a Mr Peabody suit* turns to me "Quiet you!" ...ok I'm off.
(20min delay)