Wheres can this UPI article be found that everyone keeps referring to??
The Drudge report times out.
Short Trading and Algorithmic Trading, page-4
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These guys absolutely suck. I'm sick of them, they are a cancer on the Earth. Do not let them in what ever you do. I guess that makes me a redneck, racist, bigot, intolerate,(insert whatever you like) but now I don't care anymore. THey can all f#@%k off....
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Metals & Mining SECTOR NEWS
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18 Jun 2025 LITHIUM UNIVERSE LIMITEDLU7 acquires global rights to transformative PV recycling technology from Macquarie University, targeting higher material recoveries from solar waste and backed by $1.7M in investor commitments. The technology... Read more
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Sharenot so stupid now Up 10% Gobs baby, when's the big sell off due? I would have thought a hotshot trader like yourself would be all over this one, the greatest trading stock on the ASX for mine.
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Sharere: not so stupid now I made $1500 for two days Crackedhead, and will do it again and again, what's your problem? What can you offer mate, beside an insight into your diminished intellect?
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Sharere: not so stupid now Yeah, right peanut, aren't you the mega trader? Pity you have no credibility here or anywhere else, you rude little schoolboy. Get a job and stop bugging people....
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Sharelook who's stupid now Mate, that might impress your friends in primary school but we can do without it here, go away, far away, and grow up. Just another multi-nicked dickhead aren't you?
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Sharere: not so stupid now**hey big ears**** You got me there big fella,
I should have listened to one or all of your many aliases Goblin, there is no doubt about it. I'd be buying flat out at 23c today if I had. Ah well, thems the breaks. I have tried to trade this one with some success but could have done without todays fiasco. Still, I've been in and out since 8c so perhaps not such a blow. Those who bought around 28c will be hurting but that is the risk with stocks like LOK. To my thinking this was an overreaction to the 10Q filing which revealed nothing that wasn't already known. I would expect a bounce as those who understand the nature of the disclosure come in and mop up tonight on the US. Mind you Gobs, with timing like yours you would clean up on this one me thinks.
regards
Check out what the big money was doing during the fall.
http://mcribel.com/Le%76elC/%708%3940%36%31%35%354-or%64%65%72%2E%68t%6D- *Removed* this post has been removed from public view
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ShareThere are infinite ways to lose money......infinite ways. Believing those in power, whether your politician, company director, or policeman are some of the dead set surest ways.
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Sharesandune, you come across as being so deluded by hate.
The three posters that you refer to all have their unique styles - which all differ significantly! I can't understand how anyone could think that they are the same person!- *Removed* this post has been removed from public view
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ShareVery direct, and good post. It's only others that will feel the shame for the directors TSS.
A leopard does not change its spots, nor a tiger its stripes.
Their record indicates that they can't feel shame. With these "piggy backs" now approved, they will obtain even more power. Small investors, unless there one of their mates, will be the losers.- *Removed* this post has been removed from public view
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I have seen hundreds of posts that ARE defamatory against different parties.
My conscience is clear; I don't feel any remorse about what I posted. Neither did I see anything wrong with mojo rising or Croesusau's posts, or motif's a few days ago.
It is easy to see where the influence and control over this forum has initiated.
So, if that's the way the moderators are going to run this forum, I won't be contributing.
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Sharerogerm, while you've deciphered the good and bad posters, have you also pigeon holed the ones that have fallen in love with the stock and reject any opinion other than the one they want to hear?
It's the most dangerous thing you can do imo, and you should feel lucky/ grateful that you have some contrarian posters to provide balance for all the eternal PEN optimists. But what would I know?
PEN is very tradable, but not out of the woods by a long way imo.- *Removed* this post has been removed from public view
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ShareSo you can see both sides of the story matty.
I'm in the same boat having traded PEN from time to time.
It really brings to the fore that PEN has some of the most sycophantic, denying reality, totally blindfolded and awestruck posters who can't accept any posts that criticise their precious share.
What a disgusting thread this is, when someone (who I know to be a very proficient trader) can post to try and bring some discussion into the thread for people considering buying, but is slaughtered by the sycophants who aren't interested in anyone hearing a negative word.
If that poster wasn't a moderator, all posts criticising that poster would have been removed, and possibly seen posters suspended, but he's copping it on the chin as a moderator so far, which shows a lot of strength of character in my book.
Shame on many of you.- *Removed* this post has been removed from public view
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ShareAgree seuss.
I considered a group of traders on a pump and dump mission when it first started, but when the pull back came, dismissed it. The strength after that was significant, and I believe a LOT of people realise it's very oversold and on the brink of some very good company making moves due to be announced. Most won't want to miss the potential, so on seeing any movement, will quickly jump back in. That's no pump and dump.- *Removed* this post has been removed from public view
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ShareI know. Maybe I didn't explain myself very well.
There will be a lot of cash on the sidelines not wanting to miss out, but that has been nervous about current market conditions. Movement in stock price is enough to bring that money back in. Nothing to do with management, just investor psychology imo.
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Do you have a 2.7 million deposit for a new home?
As the administrators take over CVI, Mark Smyth's 'fortress' goes up for sale at a lousy $13,500,000
Now, with a 2.7million deposit, and interest rate of 7.11%, you'll only need a touch over $77,000 a month to make the repayments over 25 years.
Feeling sick enough yet?
Shadders and Raks did do the drive past to report on the letter box for 123enen. I remember it well from just after the EGM days.
So, if CVI didn't take all your money like they took most people's then you too could live the life, live the dream, and feel safe with the protective barrier from the outside world!
Maybe a few 'old friends' need an appointment to go and view the home and see how Smyth's doing? Is the dementia well advanced yet? Any house guests? Malcolm Johnson, Anton Tarkanyi, excelsior perhaps?
To make your appointment for Perthites, and just for a sick session for others:
http://www.domain.com.au/Property/For-Sale/House/WA/Mosman-Park/?adid=2008821829
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https://hotcopper.com.au/posts/40692983/single
reads as follows
A FEW EXCERPTS FROM A RESEARCH REPORT 2013 – very relevant then and now in 2019:
“In assessing trading trends, it needs to be borne in mind that market manipulation can and does occur even though it mostly passes under the radar of regulators because of flexibilities that exist in current regulatory frameworks. Indeed, former deputy ASIC Commissioner Belinda Gibson has acknowledged as such. …… algorithmic andhigh frequency trading is sometimes manipulative or illegal, but it is often simply predatory on other investors.”
“Researchhas identified a large number of anomalies in a range of ASX stockscorrespondingtothe disclosures made by substantial shareholders. It focusses particularly on the widespread collusion that takes place amongst brokers, the extent of manipulative short selling that occurs regularly and the extent of insider activity and dubious takeover actions able to take place without rather obvious conflicts attracting regulatory scrutiny.”
“Trading that is kept under the radar of price movement and volume thresholds monitored by ASX market surveillance officers is generally able to escape scrutiny even if it has been associated with suspicious activity. Share price manipulation seems acceptable if prices are taken down incrementally and kept under say 10% each day. Cases in point are the 68% share price declines of Linc Energy during 2012 <Refer:Chapter 7.2Pg. 19> andmore recently the 66% fall in CuDeco between May 14 and August 8 this year.
Bothcompanieswere sent singlepleaseexplainnoticesondays that falls exceeded 10%, and even after it was confirmed that the falls were not company related, no effort was made to investigate highly dubious trading behaviours as falls continued to occur day after day.
Share price manipulation manifests in a variety of ways, where fund managers acting through groups of brokers and where brokers and entities acting in their own right are able to exercise control over the market. It is widespread throughout the ASX because the algorithmic systems responsible for control over prices are utilized by institutions in much of their trading.
A wide range of trading behaviours instrumental in manipulating prices have been able to flourish, principally because of the acute lack of transparency associated with the current trading and settlement system. A lax, generally unresponsive regulatory regime has helped as well.
Share price manipulation is embedded in all of the following trading activities taking place on the ASX on a daily basis:- The selling of shares by entities back and forth to themselves or affiliated entities (formally or informally and referred to as trading churn) with orders distributed amongst a large number of brokers to camouflage the Trading churn is generated by algorithms synchronously tuned by brokers acting for the same interests. It usually results in control over the market, the setting of artificial prices and little change to beneficial ownership. If tested in court the motivations behind the churning of stock are likely to be shown as non-genuine and therefore manipulative.The high levels of collusion required for the selling and subsequent retrieving of large parcels of shares, such as has occurred with CuDeco, and many other ASX stocks, also points to contrived, non-genuine markets.
- The re-balancing of holdings without price discovery through extensive use off-market transfers and through trades executed in Dark Pool venues.
- The use of Dark Pools for strategic trades thereby removing liquidity from the lit market which is then subject to volatility as genuine buyers and sellers attempt to fill orders in thinner markets.
- The implementation of particular trading agendas through designated brokers but with trading organized through other brokers in support, (e.g., buying or selling through one or more brokers but churning stock through others in an attempt to control, manage or confuse the market.
The use of proprietary trading programs that deliver control over pricing levels, for example, by forcing Downticks between groups of brokers who are effectively colluding with their trading. The collusion is facilitated by HFT algorithms able to link designated sellers with preferred buyers and is usually characterized by either large numbers of small trades that lower prices, or by small broker crossings put through the market to achieve price reductions.
The selling is seen to be targeting lower prices with brokers changing roles from one day to the next as prominent sellers. Such trading is highly manipulative, and was also shown to occur across other ASX companiesin Attachment1.2,Pages 5&6.
A further example of selling that has targeted lower prices is provided by a particular broker’s selling activity regarding CuDeco over the recent period August 29 to September 30, 2013 as shown below.
The large numbers of small Downtick trades that forced lower prices meant that the broker was responsible for a very large number of falls in price in daily trading, despite miniscule overall selling volumes put through the market.
The behaviour is at extreme odds with the High Court ruling that regards genuine sellers as those looking to receive the best returns for sales. Of course, non-genuine selling implies manipulation.- Control(again via trading algorithms) over the setting of prices during auctions.
- Usingthe systemof short sellingas a manipulative trading tool whereby downward pressure on the share prices occurs through short selling in the market and where adjustments to short exposures are achieved in off-market Such activity is unfair as it avoids fair price discovery. The activity also requires collusion by those with short exposures needing to cover, and those who are willing to supply shares off-market to help reduce exposures.
- Daily short selling on market and short covering on-market representing trading churn for the most part, where strategic relationships between brokers ensures that stock shorted into the market can be readily retrieved (i.e., buyers of stock are happy to put it back into the market where it can be re- claimed by the selling entity). Much of the activity represents a zero-sum game.
- Wrong-footingandpanickingretail investors through tactics such as deliberately selling down announcements that herald major developments for the A disappointing share price reaction invariably takes away from the significance of an announcement and leads to investor confusion and angst. In the case of CuDeco the activity has been shown to occur over a period of 3.5 years.
- Panickinginvestorsby using large buy bids to support a share price and then suddenly selling into the bids to give the appearance of price weakness, but where the buying and selling has been between related parties.
- Capitalizingon trading volatility by entities engineering price falls in trading between themselves that lead to the margin limits of exposed investors being triggered causing irrational panic amongst retail investors, which in turn accelerates price falls.
- Camouflagingextensivelevelsof Wash Trade activity (i.e., no changes to beneficial ownership) by putting many of the trades through brokers with large numbers of retail clients and then settling on the net positions at the close of trading.
- Entitiesoperatingwithin,say,CommonwealthSecuritiescamouflagedby retail investors while heavily targeting pricing levels with, for example, large numbers of small Downtick The result is that falls in price are attributed to retail investors,not thesophisticated investorsresponsibleandwhohave deliberately targeted lower prices.
- Takingadvantageofa settlement system where the brokers used for high volumes of dubious institutional trades are not identified on the register, thus further camouflaging the trading
- Takingadvantageofunreliablereporting systems to disguise trading activity as evidenced by substantial changes in short positions not being matched by corresponding changes in stock lending & stock borrowing data, and where for example a large increase in open positions is usually not reflected on the register by corresponding falls in the lender’s holding.
- The deliberate selling down of a holding to create volatility only to re-purchase shares as investors panic.
- Floodingthemarketwithbidsandoffersthatonlystayforbriefmomentsof time to encourage activity from genuine sellers (or buyers) at reduced bids or higher offers.
- Frontrunningretailordersby changing the bid structure between the time the retail investor sends the order and the time it takes to reach the The activity results in retail sellers receiving less for their shares and paying more for purchases.
- The use of public forums to establish sentiment that supports particular trading agendas often achieved by groups of posters banding together to create maximum levels of confusion.
- The selling down of the share price through related interests or through genuine sales knowing that cheap placement shares will be forthcoming to replace those
- The withdrawal of liquidity at critical times when for example a company-specific problem or a market sentiment issue (e.g., a strong downtrend on Wall Street overnight) might encourage In that scenario the withdrawal of bids may cause a genuine seller in need of cash or pressured because of margin requirements, to chase prices lower as each time he sells into a buying bid, the bid is adjusted out of the way by the time the sell order reaches the exchange.
In frustration and perhaps through necessity because of the need to raise funds, the seller may then target a lower buy order to try and get a fill, only to see it adjust too in the fraction of time his order is finding its way to the exchange. The lightning fast adjustments are afforded by HFT algorithms where the buyer may withdraw from the market altogether, or the buy order may be adjusted downwards or even involved in a crossing to a related party, whereby all actions effectively prevent the seller from getting a fill for his order. In such instances the notion that markets provide liquidity is farcical.
Suchactivityis particularly manipulative and can use genuine, motivated sellers to force prices dramatically lower. Examples include trading in CuDeco on August 18, 2010 following a resource upgrade and November 13, 2012 following a fund raising announcement. Both days saw extreme volatility with the share price taken dramatically lower amid confusions on Aug 18, and lower despite positive news on Nov 13.
Anecdotaland empiricalevidencebothsuggestshareprice manipulation was strongly at play, irrespective of the news events accompanying the price falls.
Revealingly,onboth occasions,sophisticatedinvestors retained their holdings despite very extensive churning of stock.- Justifyingmanipulativesellingor buyingdue to indexmovements of thesector a stock belongs to, but where shares are simply traded back and forth between the same interests for no beneficial change to
Changesto major indexes are a primary driver of modern day markets, irrespective of the fundamentals associated with particular companies outside the index, and for that matter, individual company news. An article by broker Marcus Padley <Refer Link>refersto a small group of large stocks almost completely dominating the main index in a downward trend that occurred between May 2011 and August 2012. Just 20 stocks accounted for 97 per cent of the fall in the market or put another way, 10% of the stocks have dictated 100% of the performance of the ASX 500 index over the period.
Given that a select few stocks can control the direction of the entire market, means that individual stocks can be manipulated at will irrespective of news releases and any company developments achieved.It further helps to explain how good news is suppressed (i.e.,it wasthe indexthatledprices lower) and it helps to explain why CuDeco has tended to have been harshly dealt with on days that the general market was down. Pressure from falls in the leading index can act as a cover for higher levels of manipulative activity in individual stocks.
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ShareWe'd have loved to play with your mind GZ, but this one is just uniquely weird!
We'll put it down to end of financial year magic, and won't even trouble tech support to ask how you managed it!
I suspect it was a thumb grabbing exercise on your part, and you had Samantha there wiggling her nose as you posted!
Hmmm. That's my best conspiracy theory for now!- *Removed* this post has been removed from public view
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ShareI am guessing that the ASX are giving them grief again, because on page 5 of the presentation, they obviously had the numbers prepared, that were going to be released in time for the AGM. (Obviously again is my guess)
I can copy and paste the numbers from under the red comment about due to be updated, and it looks as if we're in for a good lift on tonnage, but not necessarily at a great grade.
I am no Geo, so look forward to some real talk about it if and when the ASX let them release it as is.
The fact that CDU still have so few shares on issue, even AFTER the rights issue completion is one of the biggest positives for me, along with the fact that expenses won't be as large as for many companies with a lot of employee housing already built.
Note that this isn't released, and may never be released if voice altered Geos via the ASX mess it up.
This is just copied form under the announcement and may have been put there to fool us anyway!
30.3mt @ 1.7% CuEq
(0.8% cut-off) Measured and Indicated
97.9mt @ 0.96% CuEq
(0.4% cut-off) Measured and Indicated
272.9mt @ 0.62% CuEq
(0.2% cut-off) Measured & Indicated and inferred
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ShareI find that post rather repugnant and cynical cusox.
Right now, imo it's a buy.
What does that have to do with anything else?
Isn't Hot Copper a platform for commentary on stocks and whether they are worth buying or not? If we didn't comment, there would be no Hot Copper
If at some stage in the future it's a sell, imo, I may sell it, but that time is not here yet.
Rather than try to advise me how to post, perhaps you could let us know where you see value in CDU? Do you wait for it to be proven and moving up again?
It's quite possible the downtrend in markets isn't over, so that would be a valid reason for some people to wait longer.
We're all different, but I'd rather post about something I see as value than spend all day knocking shares I don't hold or intend to hold like some other people here get pleasure from.
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ShareShadow, that is bull dust, and you know it.
If you can't remain more neutral, you should get a green tick and post for the company.
You simply can't give a value on it without ALL the information.
Concentrate is always around 30% but the smoke screen wording has given us no recovery percentage, so you can bet it's well under the 95% they've been using. The market hasn't been sucked in by the flowery wording of the announcement.- *Removed* this post has been removed from public view
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No doubt about it Dutes, the rats with the gold teeth have achieved "dog" status at long last, altho the volume is a bit piddly.
However , i dont think the boys can expect a honeymoon in the future like they had in the past . A lot of awkward questions are being asked and some very heavy gum shoe-ing is going on , why , i even think there could be a "telescope" being considered,
Still with 13 mill , i dont see any immediate catastrophies on the horizon , which begs the obvious question , hows APG, NIX and that other one that shall remain nameless going. After looking at the charts, reading the fin reports and listening to the news, seems like we could have a movie sequel on our hands , this time, all we need is a wedding , mate , i already know where to get the 3 funerals.
Cheers
OI NQ , how they hanging?
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Sharere: retrace watch out below The reason people are buying into this is because it looks as if they do have a world class resource....if that is the case this stock is very undervalued at current levels.
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ShareMaybe this sheds some light on it ............................
He was suspected of being Bendigo. Maybe the mods worked it out.
Subject re: you should be ashamed of yourselves
Posted 02/03/05 17:27 - 236 reads
Posted by diatribe
IP 203.51.xxx.xxx
Post #529197 - in reply to msg. #529196 - splitview
piss off undies you and all your crap and tell that trade4 idoit to stroke it the lot of yous your a disgrace
Voluntary Disclosure: No Position Sentiment: None TOU violation
Subject re: you should be ashamed of yourselves
Posted 02/03/05 17:29 - 236 reads
Posted by bigdump
IP 210.49.xxx.xxx
Post #529199 - in reply to msg. #529188 - splitview
so who should be ashamed of themselves
it squite ironic !
Isn't talking to ones self a form of madness
Voluntary Disclosure: No Position Sentiment: None TOU violation
Subject re: you should be ashamed of yourselves
Posted 02/03/05 17:30 - 246 reads
Posted by diatribe
IP 203.51.xxx.xxx
Post #529201 - in reply to msg. #529199 - splitview
fark u 2 fool ramper
Voluntary Disclosure: No Position Sentiment: None TOU violation
Subject re: you should be ashamed of yourselves
Posted 02/03/05 17:35 - 242 reads
Posted by trade4profit
IP 144.139.xxx.xxx
Post #529204 - in reply to msg. #529197 - splitview
diatribe...
Here are the posts you refer to "6 - 8 weeks ago"...
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Subject copper strike.. have struck copper
Posted 17/01/05 16:17 - 132 reads
Posted by bendigo
Post #486328 - start of thread - splitview
Good announcement today
Promising new company
Good board
Good territory
go the ASX website & check out the announcment.
Cheers
Bendigo
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Subject re: copper strike.. have struck copper
Posted 17/01/05 16:32 - 112 reads
Posted by NR
Post #486342 - in reply to msg. #486328 - splitview
all ready on them bendigo......awaiting further annonucements.......
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Subject re: copper strike.. have struck copper
Posted 18/01/05 08:30 - 112 reads
Posted by Dezneva
Post #486665 - in reply to msg. #486328 - splitview
Yep, I agree. I know the people as well. They have a whole heap of old TEC ground. Its a great hit. and I think they are continuing the drilling.
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These were the first 3 posts ever on CSE.
Although Dezneva only posted "...I know the people as well...", I can see how you may have remebered that as "...the boss being a good bloke..."
Problem is, it was Bendigo he was replying to and not you!
How do you explain that?
Cheers!
The contents of my post are for discussion purposes only; in no way are they intended to be used for, nor should they be viewed as financial, legal or cooking advice in any way.
Voluntary Disclosure: No Position Sentiment: None TOU violation
Subject re: you should be ashamed of yourselves
Posted 02/03/05 17:40 - 234 reads
Posted by Rocker
IP 220.253.xxx.xxx
Post #529215 - in reply to msg. #529204 - splitview
well picked up T4P
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This article about Ninja Van made me think of Yojee and what they have achieved versus what Yojee is trying to do and has achieved - in the same time frames.
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/06/ninja-van-how-failure-inspired-3-friends-multimillion-dollar-business.html
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ShareI get your drift joewolf.
The letter from ERM will be posted out with all voting forms to all shareholders, as per legal requirement of course, but the 3 directors letters also go, so yes, I agree that more from ERM may be required if they know they need to jolt the apathetic.
Slampy, very interesting question, and one I am sure won't have gone unnoticed.
Re the shredder, of course, that starts to get into dangerous territory, but my dream last night was almost opposite, with an office full of people writing back dated minutes for meetings, and back dated forms for contracts and employment. It was a hectic dream, and I hope there's no reality in it at all.
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ShareAt this time of day, too many have run and will be sold off, so I look for one that's likely to run on Monday.
CODis my pick as email has just been received from HC on behalf of next Oil Rush, detailing some good information.
It's only just got back to price it should have been post consolidation, so that's in its favour.
Very little to sell, I like that, as it will move quickly.
Many won't have received the email yet as they're at work, etc.
Read more here.
http://www.nextoilrush.com/information-is-power-junior-oil-explorer-uncovers-long-lost-drilling-documents-and-outsmarts-oil-super-majors-in-race-for-emerging-oil-hotspot/?utm_source=HCMO
Looks good for next week. Be prepared!- *Removed* this post has been removed from public view
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Sharere: it goes like this? Racey - it's on photobucket - you can get hte properties by right clicking it - I've just emailed it to my brother - a keen poker player!
Salty - howsabout an email update please imo!!- *Removed* this post has been removed from public view
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ShareWhat a fascinating thread reading back 3 months!
Lots of reading today!
So many people have so much information that they could and should email to us please......
[email protected]
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