The Gore hysteria must be dissipating.

Originally posted by Marum: ↑

@belcurve. At least you are arguing the subject to a degree. Most with your views argue from the moral high ground - akin to they who profess faith. Honestly, even if I knew nothing about Physics or Chemistry, I would be skeptical. The reason for that is our illustrious ladies and gentlemen of the Fifth Estate. When they espouse and proselytize a cause célèbre they are invariably wrong. They are usually only trying to increase their own (self-perceived) fame.

Of course I agree with you, that humans are changing the planet. But seeing you cannot perceive what i mean, i will explain it in detail. We are miniscule in the face of natural disasters. ie. Mt Tambore Krakatoa, Mt Pinatubo, Mt St Helens. Sorry if I harp on about volcanoes, but they are a speciality of mine.

Let us deal with the South Pacific - where we live. Take the El Niño and La Niña events, which the press used to mention every day, and has since largely forgotten. Now. The tropical western Pacific is a "hot pool" in the Pacific Ocean. there are temperature gradients across the Pacific, or "thermoclines" if you prefer. Now the ENSO has a period of up to eight years and the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO) which is observed over the whole Pacific hand has a periodicity of two or three decades. Therefore, even they who are aware of this, have only figure for less than two hundred years. This temperature variation, was noted by Peruvian fishermen centuries ago. So we are basing assumptions on incomplete data.

I could go on, but you will merely change the subject to something which I know little about. Then you will reckon you have negated my whole argument. For like all fanatics you have to prove nothing, you merely - like the religious perverts, - claim you have faith. Interestingly, when I brought this up with a religious friend, he merely said. "GOD will provide." ergo; we need to do nothing, I guess.

Now to finish with: The rising ocean levels. (roll of drums) The islands up near PNG that they talk about. The oceans may or may not be rising, but those islands are sinking. They are in a subduction zone. Read up on the Indo-Australian Plate.

I agree with you that we need to curb our use of non-renewable assets, and live within our environmental budget. But most of the arguments are merely political. These nutters want to gain power, and tell everyone else what to do.

Over their dead bodies they will....Marum.

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Golly Marum, golly you're giving that drum a nasty workover. And a strange one at that.

so, someone like me, who accepts science, including the science coming from AGW and climate change, is a fanatic. I guess that makes meteorologists at NOAA and BoM, who measure temperature, air pressure, rainfall etc, fanatics as well.

Ditto, atmospheric scientists, physicists, programmers at NASA, who in recent days fanatically landed their spacecraft on the surface of Mars, and then started touring it.

at least, i'm in good scientific company then compared to say your average climate change deniers, who elevate their empty pseudoscience to mythical status espoused by such heroes as Andrew Bolt and Craig Kelly. Is it still fair to judge people on the company they keep Marum?

it might be worth getting up to speed on the factors affecting AGW and climate change, unless you're blinded by your own volcanic tumescence, which can't be ruled in or out.

two of my go to sources for all things climate science are NASA and NOAA, which of course weigh known knowns in their climate science and analysis, including the influence of ENSO.

to get up to speed on this please note the Following are key excerpts from a global climate report issued mid February by the National Centers for Environmental Information, which operates in NOAA. they come from an internet page ncdc.noaa.gov.

"The January 2021 global land and ocean surface temperature was 0.80°C (1.44°F) above the 20th century average and ranked as the seventh warmest January in the 142-year global records.

"January 2021 also marked the 45th consecutive January and the 433rd consecutive month with temperatures, at least nominally, above the 20th-century average.

."The year began with a La Niña episode in the tropical Pacific Ocean that started in August 2020. The El Niño-Southern Oscillation (ENSO) can affect global temperatures. La Niña tends to cool global temperatures slightly, while El Niño tends to boost global temperatures.

"With a slightly cool start to the year, there is only a 2.9% chance of 2021 ending as the warmest year on record. However, there is an over 99% chance of the year ranking among the 10 warmest years on record."

You could be drawing a long bow in suggesting the Krakatoa explosion has any impact on today's climate given that blew in 1883. But i've heard vulcans claim to know a thing or two.

(btw, having transited Sunda Strait both lengthways and crossways, i was understandably enthralled by Simon Winchester's hugely informative and entertaining book Krakatoa: The Day The World Exploded. It's a great read and i would recommend it bar for a rumour you helped write it.)