lucas I'll agree to disagree re howard surely,though you must be questioning the current direction some of their policies are taking . After all who are they serving - sure as hell ain't the majority. Voters will remember .Like you say though there is a credibility problem with labour - Julia gillard has the "ticker" kim beasley doesn't and should be leading labour as well as presenting a favourable appearence for women voters. The only forseeable way I can see labour getting over the line with their current crop . Beasely =should have been a liberal.