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whereu

27,387 Posts.

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21/06/24

15:44

Post #: 74428815
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Originally posted by wotsup: ↑

@whereu

I only just spotted the following nonsense of yours.

"The debate is about where Jesus was when God created.
1:16 "For in him all things were created":
Clearly, Jesus was around according to scripture when God created.
You don't understand how God created all things in him so you want to rewrite scripture to fit with your lack of understanding.
If you understood the Trinity you would would understand this.
If he was the first born of creation, then his creation precedes the rest of creation.
The verse does not say that Jesus was the first plan by God of creation but that he was the first born of creation.
It often doesn't take much to take your silly posts apart.

Now try putting your fanciful ideas about God's plans aside that demonise scripture and read what scripture actually says."

""The debate is about where Jesus was when God created.
1:16 "For in him all things were created":
Clearly, Jesus was around according to scripture when God created."

OK then know it all, how on earth could God literally create all things IN Jesus?

Col 1:16 - For in Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.

So lets us show what the Bible Demands of us, in understanding what "in him" MUST mean, along with the Interlinear, for the Greeks definition of Their word through.

"all things were created" -> Isa 44:24 - Thus says Yehowah, your Redeemer who formed you from the womb: “I Yehowah,who has made all things, who alone stretched out the heavens, who by Myself spread out the earth,
Psa 33:6, 9 - By the word of Yehowah were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth.
For He spoke, and it wasdone;He commanded, and it stood fast.

Soo what was Jesus doing while this was going on, picking his nose

"For in him" -> what does that mean, considering the clear and obvious above, hmm, well if we pay attention to the whole story of 1:16, we will CLEARLY get to the Truth.
"Through"
dia: through, on account of, because of
Original Word:διά
Part of Speech:Preposition
Transliteration:dia
Phonetic Spelling:(dee-ah')
Definition:through, on account of, because of
Usage:(a) gen: through, throughout, by the instrumentality of, (b) acc: through, on account of, by reason of, for the sake of, because of.

Hence is becomes VERY CLEAR, that the "in him" context, is clearly in reference to all these reasons, that Yehowah alone and by himself created = for the future one to be, born at Mary, the Only and first beginnings of the man Jesus, for which the Col passages are referring to.
So that means, due to his actual birth, he cannot be a literal firstborn of creation, but was simply the firstborn of creation in the mind and plans of God, right where all our creations and plans begin.
In the same context, the Jesus to be was the beginning of the creation of God Rev 3:14, 13:8 etc.

Another important part of Col which you obviously chose to ignore, also confirms the above.
1:18 - And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; so that in allthings he might have the preeminence.

If he pre-existed and Co equal as the trinity clan claim, then he would already of had preeminence, especially of his creation efforts etc.Prior to this, the plan was clearly that, a plan that he would have preeminence, but that clearly only literally come to be, after the cross and had he not be the firstborn from the dead, it suggests that he wouldn't be holding preeminence.

So the "in Him" all things were created, is clearly, for this reason, him, the one to be from Mary, all things were created.

Out of all the OT prophesies of a future Jesus, show me just one where it says that this future one already existed in some way shape or form, that would come down and take upon flesh or enter Mary.
If you cannot find such, then you should not be ADDING such a crazy notion = it's as simple as that, stop tampering with scripture and adding.

Expand

@wotsup showing why he thinks that there is no response to his posts.
He didn't notice them...
as he didn't notice responses to his other nonsense.

1:16 "For in him all things were created".
For in him all things were created.
So he was around when all things were created.
Unless Jesus did some sort of time travel back into the past?
These verses were not about the future but about what happened in the past - in this case about what transpired at creation.
Calling it about a future Jesus is your addition to scripture.
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